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Tell Us What You Think
name: Blake Rosser
email: Kashmir167@aol.com
Tuesday, 19-Jan-1999 19:22 PST
All of the hoopla surrounding the Papal visit to St. Louis is ridiculous.
As a high school student in St. Louis, i am witnessing firsthand just how crazy
things are getting. Parents are mad that our public school is not being
called off, but why should it be? School is not cancelled for jewish or
muslim holidays, why should this purely Christian event merit a local holiday?
In my humble opinion, Pope John Paul II is no different than the average man,
except that he tells people he is holier than they are. Oh yeah, there's that
really cool hat too.
name: Brian Blaha
email: i_am_chaos_theory@yahoo.com
Tuesday, 19-Jan-1999 22:49 PST
I live in the St. Louis area, and I'm just going
to stay inside during the whole spectacle. I
really don't care if the pope comes here, and
since the city will more than recoup their costs
for the trip, and since the economy will get a
boost, I don't have a problem with the money
spent. Despite being in favor of diplomatic
recognition of Vatican City, I do not favor
placing great weight on it's opinions. France, for
example, is big, has a lot of people, and has an
army. It is important to listen carefully to them.
Vatican City has very few people, is tiny, and has
no army at all (unless you count the guards).
name: Huascar Terra do Valle
email: huascarvalle@hotmail.com
Wednesday, 20-Jan-1999 19:59 PST
All religions, with no exceptions, turn fanatic and sectarian when given
political power. The Inquisition was no exception. Religions usually elicit
more hatred than love, therefore they should be free to preach their faith
but never can have political power lest heads will roll.
name: J.R. Ector
email: jr.ector@mail.sprint.com
Thursday, 21-Jan-1999 09:39 PST
I'm a former catholic which may make me a little more
leary of the control that the vatican aspires to have
over peoples lives. It's very scary to have a group
of so-called celibate men, who have obviously made some
very bad life decisions, telling you how to live your life.
The US government should NOT recognize the vatican
as a state, it's ridiculous! It's very dangerous to
allow them to influence our electoral system considering
these are the same people who ran the inquisition and
retarded the advancement of science because it didn't
agree with their party line. Unforutnately people's
fear and ignorance make them pay homage to a man that
to them may have god's ear, as if!
name: N. Phillips
email: phillinj@slu.edu
Thursday, 21-Jan-1999 11:28 PST
The city of St. Louis stands to lose money on this
visit, since the Archdiocese is only picking up
the rental and staffing costs of the TWA dome.
Streets, police, public transit overtime costs,
garbage disposal, repairing lawn
damage to the park where the youth rally is held
after the event is done - all these expenses are
assumed by the city and its tax base (of which I am
one). Furthermore, most city and state offices in
downtown St. Louis will be closed for the duration,
and most downtown non-food-service businesses
depending on walkin traffic will be severely affected.
The economic impact of this visit is bad for most
businesses and taxpayers, and there is no way that
hot-dog sales can compensate. Furthermore, this is
an event that will not raise significant interest
in St. Louis as a place to live or do business. The
city should have gotten far more money from the
archdiocese to cover costs. If the archdiocese could
not afford the bill, the pope should have gone to a
bigger city such as Chicago. I am not opposed to
the pope coming to St. Louis, in fact I am happy for
those Catholics who want to see him, but just to
the fact that the secular government is picking up
a significant proportion of the tab, money that
would be better directed to our public schools.
St. Louis city resident
name: Carletta Sims
email: csims@atheists.org
Thursday, 21-Jan-1999 22:57 PST
The Pope is obviously a religious symbol. However, it looks as though he is
also a political agent to the U.S. We don't need him at all! The U.S., in
the Pope's absence, does a fine job on medical research and other social,
cultural issues, so we don't need him to endorse or give comment on any
opinion about the U.S. and its goings-on, period. It's difficult to believe
that the "walking dead" would be honored. The U.S. Government
should stop the visits. I've heard, though, on the Frontline show on PBS
that the Pope has been a political ally in the past, to pick up information
from other governments, which would be suspicious about U.S. diplomats;
therefore, the Pope was able to get the info the U.S. wanted. Perhaps there's
a bigger agenda, then, on behalf of the U.S. But, one would think that by now
the heads of other governments would know the Pope to be what he is, a spy.
There's nothing new under the sun. Religion has always been a tool whereby
distasteful tasks were accomplished under the fool's nose--you know you're
being tricked, but you just don't get it. Maybe Robertson and Falwell will
get jealous, and demand his absence, we hope.
name: randall reiss
email: randalljr@netscape.net
Friday, 22-Jan-1999 12:56 PST
By affording the vatican diplomatic status, a serious
breech of the seperation of church and state has been
imposed (if ever there really was one!). At the same
time however, I see an oportunity for atheists to bring other church/state
issues to light. Can we not now request diplomatic status for a
representative athiest group?
This of course would only be fair. What better way to
"mainstream" ourselves.
As a people, we are yet very fragmented. Instead of merely complaining
of other's transgretions, we need to react and find a way to be more visible.
It always seems that the squeaky wheel gets the grease. What are any of our
various groups and associations doing to organize on a national level? Can we
not somehow find a way to entice the media to elicit a representative
opinion from us on any given news item? I'm afraid it is time
for us to jump into the problem if we aspire to solve it.
name: Robert Gilmer
email: rsgilmer@unity.ncsu.edu
Friday, 22-Jan-1999 14:35 PST
Pope, Shmope
Dope-on-a-rope.
Sits in his plastic car and mopes.
Says that he offers hope? Nope!
For strange ideas he grasps and gropes,
But with Roman Catholics, I can't cope.
I wish I could wash his mouth out with soap!
That's what I think of the Pope.
Just a small poem that I composed for his "holey-ness's" visit.
Obviously, I think very little of Vatican leadership and Catholocism
in general.
name: John Favinger
email: swampjohn@yahoo.com
Saturday, 23-Jan-1999 17:44 PST
The Roman Catholic Church is already exempt from property tax, let them use
that amount to pay for the pope's visit. I don't like my tax dollars spent
to protect or serve any religious leader.
name: Jeffrey L. Teel
email: jeffteel@ibm.net
Sunday, 24-Jan-1999 01:37 PST
I was just a little boy when the Pope was shot. At the time it stuck a
strange chord with me, but I thought nothing of it. Being the desensetized
American that I am, I simply brushed it aside as being another old guy wearing
white clothes with a shiny new bullet in him.
As another year passes and another Catholic "State of the Religion"
address approaches, the significance of that bullet has become even more
apparent to me.
No one with even the most liberal interpretation of right and wrong can really
justify the attempted murder of another individual. But as I recall the
replay of that shooting that I first witnessed on the nightly news as a young
child I realize that finally, after all the deaths that have occured in the
name of religion, this for me was the first shot against religion.
This was the day that the seed of doubt was planted in me. From this day
forward, I began to question the relevance, not to mention the righteousness
of a supposedly all powerful creator. This seed eventually blossomed into my
own personal tree of knowledge.
The first thought that I ever had associated with a doubt in "God"
was, 'If God can predict the future and control the minds and actions of all,
why would he allow someone to assault his greatest spokesman?' This question
has since been resolved. Obviously, the answer to that question is that there
simply is no God. There is no supreme contoller of beings. There is no big
brother in the sky. The lives of men and women alike are not controlled by
spirits and demons.
Now mind you, I am not glad that the Pope was shot. I wouldn't wish that upon
any living creature. Certainly the pain was unbearable. For me, however, the
shooting of the Pope was an ignitor. It was an ignitor of a fire that will
burn, and hopefully spread forever.
name: Ron A. Larsen
email: rl45531@navix.net
Sunday, 24-Jan-1999 15:12 PST
The Roman Catholic Church poses no threat to the
separation of church and state because this
"separation" exists only on paper. Separation is,
unfortunately, theoretical. In practice, Amerikka
is a Xian theocracy. Until Atheists realize this,
no meaningful action can occur. Puck the Fope!
name: Duane C. Buchholz
email: tincan@cyberhighway.net
Sunday, 24-Jan-1999 20:43 PST
The Vatican is not a state. It is the headquarters of a church and should
be accorded no diplomatic standing. It sort of reminds me of another haven
for thieves in old Wyoming called the "hole-in-the-wall".
I don't know who invited the Pope here, but for me, he is persona non grata.
I resent the spending of one cent of taxpayer money on this "dog and
pony" show and for an American president and vice president to court
this silly old man in a designer dress is reprehensible.
If JP II got no publicity at all it would please me. Sorry I couldn't make
the St. Louis protest.
name: Dave Hanson
email: militantatheist@yahoo.com
Sunday, 24-Jan-1999 22:21 PST
Pat Robertson is a bigger threat to separation of church and state than the
Pope. The Pope has only Catholic followers, Robertson has Protestant,
Catholic and even Jewish followers.
name: Charles Fiterman
email: cef@geodesic.com
Monday, 25-Jan-1999 08:15 PST
Picketing the Pope's visit is rude crude and
foolish. Just the kind of thing that will make
us more hated than we are. Remember the man
is at death's door. I guarantee he will go through
that door and we will be made sorry about this
picket.
The right approach is to be friendly and silent.
name: Joseph F. Pennock
email: druid@ris.net
Monday, 25-Jan-1999 10:53 PST
When the pope visited Denver, Colorado a few years back, the city was glutted
with ovine catholics and catholic wanna-be's, most of whom had no interest or
will to think for themselves on topics which require simple logic.
The spectacle of thousands of reveling sheep was an absolute embarrassment
even lower on the evolutionary scale than any public display on the level of
muddy Woodstock or drunken Broncomania. Here is an aging, doddering,
egotistical spokesman for the deity, laying down rules on such profoundly
personal functions as reproduction, contraception, lovemaking, the right to
life, and even the right to death. The self-righteous followers of the
pontiff, like self-righteous fundamentalist protestants, nod their empty heads
vigorously in agreement with every utterance from their spiritual leader.
What makes a good catholic nowadays? A mindless follower who has been
brainwashed into believing that faith in higher powers and trust in
self-serving leaders is all that is needed to be a complete, moral person.
It is the duty of devout papists to be violently homophobic, vehemently
anti-choice, militantly anti-Kervorkian, and furiously pro-censorship. Here,
in the final year of the Twentiety Century, we witness an enemy of humanity
telling millions of Mexicans it is a sin to practice birth control. Meanwhile,
back in Northern Ireland, catholics are killing other christians for such
primitive reasons as a difference between transubstantiation and consubstantion!
The Vatican State should no longer be recognized as a nation! The fact that
the USA has diplomatic relations with such a farcical "country" is
an abomination. What could prevent the United States from sending billions
in foreign aid to the Vatican for such frivolities as restoring their artwork,
repairing their chimneys, and supplying new hats and robes? How can we forget
the Vatican's interference in our nation's military integrity when it gave
Manuel Noreiga safe refuge in its consulate in Panama? How can we forgive the
countless times the pope's foreign agents preached from their pulpits to urge
their congregations to vote against human rights ordinances whenever gay
protections were included? How can we overlook the fact that the Vatican
gave protection, new identities, and safe conduct to Nazis at the end of
W.W.II? On the other hand, what else can we expect from a club which
requires its members to practice an act of simulated cannibalism at every
gathering? When will the catholic church, under the leadership of a truly
humane pope, stop preaching the nonsense of virgin birth, a jewish boy being
a christian god, a circle of dried flour becoming a piece of Jesus' flesh,
devils tempting us and angels protecting us? Maybe when pigs start flying.
name: Neil Rotter
email: nrotter@optonline.net
Monday, 25-Jan-1999 12:49 PST
I am adamently against school vouchers.
I believe the amount of money that is currently
going to private and parochial schools should be
returned to the public venue. The argument that
the money is going for secular training only is
specious. It just offsets the cost of religious
training.
If you want to send you child to a non-public school,
you should bear those costs. School taxes are for
the public as a whole and should not be given to
private organizations. You should not be able to
offset private and parochial education with a return
of school tax moneys.
name: John L. Barnes
email: mems@concentric.net
Monday, 25-Jan-1999 17:16 PST
The fear of erosion of State/Church separation is unfounded concerning the
papal visit. It is true that the Pope acts as both a head of state in a
secular sense and Vicarius Fillii Dei in an ecclesiastical one. His
recognition by United States as executive of the Vatican has made no
establishment of religion w/in U.S borders. The United States can not refuse
recognition of the Vatican and hold recognition to other states -- many of
which are located in the Eastern Hemishpere. One major controversy w/regard
to immigration in Israel today is over who is truely a Jew, the distinction
based on traditional observance of Judaism. Queen Elizabeth II is officially
the "head" of the Anglican church and "Defender of the
Faith". Iran is an official theocracy, while one of the Middle East's
most powerful leaders, the king of Saudi Arabia, is protectorate of the two
holiest cities of Islam -- Medina, and Mecca. Shall we also mention the
Spanish government whose constitutional monarchy names Alfonzo as "His
Most Catholic Majesty . . ." as well as "King of Jerusalem."
By excluding Vatican City and un-recognizing her as a political identity,
the United States runs the risk of offending the majority of its allies, most
of which belong in Catholicdom. American Atheist and the Roman Catholic
Church admit that most American Catholics are at odds with the official dogma
of "Holy Mother Church" concerning things very important to church
teaching (i.e. abortion, birth control, women priests &tc.) It would appear
that the fear of her power of persuation in U.S. policy is over estimated by
AA.
name: D. Vincent
email: Bluemanity@hotmail.com
Tuesday, 26-Jan-1999 15:03 PST
Thursday is my birthday. What could be a better gift than American Atheists
picketing the pope. Unfortunately I cannot make it, but good luck you guys!
name: Dr. Marilyn T. Welles
email: m.t.welles@ieee.org
Tuesday, 26-Jan-1999 15:35 PST
Politically, we have to keep in mind that the
Religious Right (Christian Coalition et al)
currently presents a MUCH greater threat to our
lives and liberties than the Catholic Church.
The Roman Catholic Church can be used as a counter-
foil to all those right-wing nuts. At least, the
Pope speaks out against the excesses of capitalism,
while the Religious is hell-bent on destroying
Clinton even if it takes down the whole country.
The Roman Catholic Church can be used as a counter-
Instead of attacking the Vatican at this point in
time, we should strive for "why don't you guys go
fight it out" and encourage the RC's and the RR to
have at each other.
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